New houseparents' accommodation on the back avenue

[lonelymom]

Isn't it time to put this one to bed now?

I agree. As Mrs C said, if anyone has any comments/views on what is happening they should contact those that make the decisions. Mrs C was giving her opinion as somebody who has lived on site for some years. In many of the threads Mrs C is asked for her opinion/advice/help as a valuable member of staff, it therefore seems unfair to knock her for doing so.

[Mrs C.]

[What concerns me far more are that pupils are failing to have regard for others and are using what you call appalling language. These are things that any sensible parent expects a decent school to correct, correct and correct again until you don't have the justification for writing it. That comes down to the headmaster and how he enforces decent behaviour

Sadly it`s a reflection of society in general. By no means specific to CH.
When kids get together they often act in a completely different way to how they`d act at home.

i know , for example, some parents are aghast when they find out that their child has been punished from smoking or drinking.
They might not do it at home, but peer pressure is a powerful thing.

And to be fair to our pupils, the majority are normally polite and fairly well-mannered in the presence of staff.

[nastymum]

I would like to say that I am truly sorry if Mrs C feels got on a personal level because she has expressed her opinion. I can see why it would be desirable in some ways to put the issue 'to bed' but while I am worried about Mrs C's feelings what I find truly scary is the thought that people would not be interested enough to get heated about issues that involve the welfare of the pupils-or the staff . It is far healthier that they care enough to say something and it would be really dreadful if people just ignored or accepted everything that went on the school.
What she says about the school council is heartening(the pupils certainly think so) and I do think she has hit the nail on the head when she mentioned some sort of similar arrangement for parents. When children are at boarding school parents do feel left out and it is really hard to get the school to hear what you want to say. Even if you live locally it is not easy . Schools are introspective places and during the school day they are the whole world to everyone who is there. I am a teacher myself and hold a senior postion in a school and I am guilty of thinking on occasions that it is really annoying when parents keep coming up and complaining and interfering with the smooth running of the school. What I have to keep constantly reminding myself is, that each child is the only child in the school to its parents and they are very precious to them. I have to ask myself every day if what I have done or how I have treated someone else's child is good enough for my child. If it is then I am happy but it's hard work.
Mrs C is right when she says that the children's behaviour is a reflection of society as a whole and also of how they have been brought up and so on. Teachers can not be responsible for how a child has developed from birth . It is true though that they should not accept what they know to be wrong in terms of behaviour simply because lots of other people do it and parents should expect that teachers would confront poor behaviour even though they may feel they are fighting a losing battle.
I am still disturbed about the comments about the way the staff who live in are having to put up with excessively bad language, noise and disruption outside there living space and I find it quite difficult to understand how this has not been addressed. Of course when the area behind the houses is built on it will stop but it will probably just move more out of sight. If the children are not challenged about what they do they will think they own that space and they will the believe that teachers are either not willing or not able to stop them and they will take that behaviour more out of sight and it will get worse.This will eventually have an impact on how they behave in lessons and so on.
Mrs C sent me a PM because she was concerned that if was so moany why would I want to send another child to the school. Obviously I think the benefits outway the disadvantages but any parent with child at the school will have an opinion about the way it is run .
I am trying to sound reasonable and humble which doesn't come naturally but this is as good as it gets.
PS
I still think I'm right.
Also there was a murder at the end of my street today. Swearing? Noise? I'd settle for that today.

[Mrs C.]

Have you ever heard children play quietly outside?
No.
it`s normal for them to be loud.
i`m not saying they`re doing anything worse than any group of children in any other place.
CH pupils are no worse than others and at no point did I intend to imply they are.
Depriving them of that would be depriving them of part of their childhood, to quote HerrS.
it is, however, very invasive on the lives of staff who live in the flats. I speak from experience. Having the equivalent of 2 boys houses playing football right under your window while you`re trying to relax and watch tv, or while young children are sleeping, is not conducive to any form of relaxation.
Although yes, it`s preferable to murder any day.

And as I said, it`s all very well getting heated about the tarmac going, but it`s happened, and there`s nothing more to be done about it.

Parents need to start asking questions and making their feelings known if feelings are running so high.
Perhaps now is the time, when changes are being made in lots of areas as a result of changing management etc. I know, however, that the school will have the childrens best interests at heart in all it`s decision-making.

And before anyone starts asking, I have absolutely no idea what may or may not be on the agenda! The pupils will probably know considerably more than I do.

[blondie95]

what I find truly scary is the thought that people would not be interested enough to get heated about issues that involve the welfare of the pupils-or the staff . It is far healthier that they care enough to say something and it would be really dreadful if people just ignored or accepted everything that went on the school.

do the last 6 pages of discussion on this topic not show that we as a group are interested enough to deabte the subject or the fact that a number of topics on this forum go into number of pages because they have opinions and views?
As Mrs C and others including myself have said, ye we have are thoughts etc but decisions are made far from us and the fact is the school have to move forward-they know the issues they face such as ensuring children get the right areas to play/meet but also that teachers come to CH and stay there for a number of years and get a good quality of environment to live in.
Just because we want to draw a line under this topic now does not mean we dont want debate-we just realise that the decision and other decisions are made way out of reach and what views we have have been aired! what more could we get from this topic?

[michael scuffil]

This I think is my last word on this topic: boarding schools are not family-friendly places. They weren't in the 50s, and to judge by Mrs C's comments, they aren't now.

They weren't meant to be. In fact, I would go as far as to say that this is part of their essence and purpose. When I discuss (and advocate) boarding schools with those who haven't had the experience I say this: adolescents find society intolerable, and society finds adolescents intolerable. Boarding schools are one way of keeping them apart and putting the kids under the supervision of people who, unlike their own parents, have seen it all so often they won't be fazed or hurt. And incidentally who can apply discipline without it getting personal.

The conclusions I draw from this I've set out earlier in this thread. I'm sorry, Mrs. C. I think you should have your accommodation on the edge of the estate, with of course a study and bedroom in the house for your duty times. But I think families have no place in the main school area.

[J.R.]

Very true Michael.

Would you say that schools are genuinely ex-pupil friendly, though ?

[Ajarn Philip]

This I think is my last word on this topic: boarding schools are not family-friendly places. They weren't in the 50s, and to judge by Mrs C's comments, they aren't now.

They weren't meant to be. In fact, I would go as far as to say that this is part of their essence and purpose. When I discuss (and advocate) boarding schools with those who haven't had the experience I say this: adolescents find society intolerable, and society finds adolescents intolerable. Boarding schools are one way of keeping them apart and putting the kids under the supervision of people who, unlike their own parents, have seen it all so often they won't be fazed or hurt. And incidentally who can apply discipline without it getting personal.

The conclusions I draw from this I've set out earlier in this thread. I'm sorry, Mrs. C. I think you should have your accommodation on the edge of the estate, with of course a study and bedroom in the house for your duty times. But I think families have no place in the main school area.

Sheesh, and I wanted to put this thread to bed!

Sorry, Michael, I respect your opinion, but I believe and hope that in the case of CH, which is the only boarding school I can speak about from personal (outdated) knowledge, I think you're very wrong. I think it is inevitable in almost every case that when parents decide to send their child to (any) boarding school, they must accept that family ties may not be as strong as they otherwise might have been. Surely that's obvious to any parent? (I speak as a former student, not as a parent, so the question is genuine.) As has been stated here and elsewhere, some children simply aren't suited to boarding school education, whatever the reason.

My own experience of CH 35 years ago, when my father was very seriously ill and before, is that CH could be extremely 'family-friendly'. For crying out loud, Michael, your post goes so far beyond the trivial topic of the back asphalt as to question the whole ethos of the school. CH gave me opportunities I couldn't have dreamed of anywhere else. I'd like to think that's why I remember the place so fondly, rather than because it provided objective discipline and kept me away from my family and 'society'.

[Ajarn Philip]

Very true Michael.

Would you say that schools are genuinely ex-pupil friendly, though ?

No! No! No! Who give a monkey's behind if it's ex-pupil friendly? What does that mean anyway? Are we going back to that access nonsense?

Oooooooooohhhhhhh!

And what was that you said, Michael, about 'families having no place in the school area'? What on earth do you mean? (Sorry, only just seen it.)

I'm a fairly laid back sort of character, but for some reason I feel very strongly about this.

[Great Plum]

My last point on the subject is that if people do feel strongly enough about the walled gardens on the back avenue, then why not write to the headmaster about this...

[jtaylor]

Is this what people are talking about?

Took it on Saturday, back of Mid. A...

[Great Plum]

That's the very thing... for those who don't know - the walled area to the left of the photo will be the 'walled gardens' of the house parents' town houses which is the back of the boarding house on the right...

[ben ashton]

Looks as hiddeous as predicted.
My questions are:

a) what budget is this work coming from and what gives it priority over other repair/construction plans that benefit pupils oppose to teachers?

b) (and this is the same thought I had when the Lamb houses were built while I was a pupil) how can a building that big be justified for 1-2 families when the volume it takes up is (appears to be when standing next to at least) half that of a boarding house which can accomodate ~50?

c) why was this 'need' for 'walled gardens' and the like not identified in the original (now abandoned) masterplan?

[englishangel]

I have stayed out of this as I don't know generalities or specifics but I cannot believe Ben's comment. It makes him sound like an old fogey (which I am sure he is not) "in my day....."

To attract good houseparents you have to offer them good accommodation. It is like nurses. In the 40s and 50s if you married you had to leave, so they did, in droves. In the 70's and 80's they weren't paid properly, "It's a calling not a profession", so they left again. Those who remain are accused of discussing their love lives acroos patients, a minority of course, my Mum had superb nurses but you know what you get if you pay peanuts...?

[gma]

Have avoided contributing to this thread as I am neither parent, teacher or pupil of Horsham but blimey people! I live a small village in Berkshire lots of open space and bucketloads of countryside to roam and run riot in together with innumerable public parks and play space, adventure trails the lot. And the kids still gather in small field space at the bottom of my garden behind the fence and gossip and laugh and try drinking and smoking amongst other things! It can drive me mad depending on the time of day (or night!) or quite frankly my mood! - but I recognise that they need someway 'safe' to 'sneak off' to and practise growing up. (Added to which some of the conversations on which I've eavesdropped are hysterical!!)

I have no children but absolutely agree with English Angel, teachers, housemistresses/masters, medical staff etc taken into a boarding school environment, if not offered the opportunity to also pursue a family life, will either be ancients or inexperienced neither of which would be good for pupils or school. One of the stong themes running through many threads on this forum is about damaged children at CH, surely evidence of the availability of a normal family life would be good here not detrimental? Normal life includes the right to some peace and privacy; and learning to consider and show respect for others would be no bad thing either. Other options would be to provide housing off school grounds which would impact adversely on the school's budget I'm damn sure!