Looking back

[sejintenej]

My son recently took part in this and He is now worried that the career suggestions will come back as Psychopath or similar..

I just hope that no pupil or teacher associates the pupil with this post. He is probably perfectly OK but he will be told otherwise. I worried about my nick-name but this ....................

[seventhirty]

In my year (under Miss Tucker) careers advice consisted of a ten minute interview with the infamous Miss Menon, an external careers advisor who was a friend of Miss Tucker, and who seems to have advised at many Independent Girls Schools. It happened to be that year when there was a big push to get women into Engineering (WISE), and I believe she advised every single girl who was taking Maths or Physics that the should do Engineering. I did actually start off doing Science at university, then made a change which was unsuccessful, and quit university. In retrospect I was not just badly advised, but should have gone in a completely different direction. The main reason I didn't was that no adult at CH ever discussed my future with me, and I felt that as I wasn't being encouraged in the way I wanted to go, then I probably wasn't good enough.

[sejintenej]

It happened to be that year when there was a big push to get women into Engineering (WISE), and I believe she advised every single girl who was taking Maths or Physics that the should do Engineering.

There is a current sweep to persuade pupils to study the sciences so teachers are being given courses to teach them how to "persuade" pupils to take such courses. There are about 8 universities involved in the teaching of which one (to my knowledge) has residential courses. Let us just say that the other universities don't seem to be totally involved yet!

[fra828]

The streaming of classes into 'A'and "B' was fairly interesting - and somewhat arbitrary to my mind. How was that decision made? I know that the 'second class' mentality seemed to seep in to "B" stream. I remember comments being made about "thick" people around O level time etc, if B streamers were 'only' taking 7 O levels etc. My ex-husband, who had been to one of the largest Comprehensives in the country was amazed at our view of all of this. I know it took me years and years to get over not having done too well at A level. I joined Mensa in my early 20s to try to convince myself that i wasn't stupid, but it didn't work. The power of CH to whittle away self esteem was huge!

Yes Kim, low self esteem has always been a problem for me too. In the B forms it was mostly 11 plus failures (or borderline pass ) . If you hadn't taken 11 plus, you probably just scraped a pass in CH entrance exam. Then again, the bright ones in the B stream were probably equal in ability to the strugglers in the A form. ( I remember admiring one girl, a year or so older, who progressed from B to A form via alpha stream )- some years, if there were a higher numbers of girls, there was an alpha stream in the middle -that seemed a good place to be; not being thought of as TOO brainy and not classed as a thicko either! In my year it was just the 2 streams, and being so unmotivated to work at Hertford, I was always hovering near the bottom of the B form.

[icomefromalanddownunder]

I don't remember having a careers interview anywhere including CH. I decided at the age of 8 what I wanted to do so maybe that's why I didn't have one. When I didn't get into medicine after repeating my A levels I had to go through clearing and chose 2 courses that also required biology, chemistry and physics - Biochemistry and Pharmacy. There wasn't any advice offered. I ended up studying Pharmacy at Manchester University and just got on with it.

I intended to study Pharmacy until one of my cousins (then a med student, later a psychiatrist specialising in sexual disfunctions) told me that it would be boring as bat poo (counting out pills all day) and that I should consider pharmacology. Had never heard of it, but applied and was accepted. Then spent three years in a state of depression while committing unspeakable acts on small furry animals, but believing that I had made my bed and had, therefore, to lie in it.

[Jo]

I was never in any doubt about what I wanted to study (at least from about the age of 13 or so onwards). French was my best subject and that's what I wanted to do at university (though with hindsight now, I would probably do history). Everything went to plan until I got my degree and then realised I didn't have a clue what I wanted to do after that. That's where I could have done with some careers advice. All I knew was that I didn't want to teach, but that wasn't much of a starting point.

[Mid A 15]

The streaming of classes into 'A'and "B' was fairly interesting - and somewhat arbitrary to my mind. How was that decision made? I know that the 'second class' mentality seemed to seep in to "B" stream. I remember comments being made about "thick" people around O level time etc, if B streamers were 'only' taking 7 O levels etc. My ex-husband, who had been to one of the largest Comprehensives in the country was amazed at our view of all of this. I know it took me years and years to get over not having done too well at A level. I joined Mensa in my early 20s to try to convince myself that i wasn't stupid, but it didn't work. The power of CH to whittle away self esteem was huge!

Yes Kim, low self esteem has always been a problem for me too. In the B forms it was mostly 11 plus failures (or borderline pass ) . If you hadn't taken 11 plus, you probably just scraped a pass in CH entrance exam. Then again, the bright ones in the B stream were probably equal in ability to the strugglers in the A form. a year or so older, who progressed from B to A form via alpha stream )- some years, if there were a higher numbers of girls, there was an alpha stream in the middle -that seemed a good place to be; not being thought of as TOO brainy and not classed as a thicko either! In my year it was just the 2 streams, and being so unmotivated to work at Hertford, I was always hovering near the bottom of the B form.

You are spot on there.

At Horsham there was a "fast" stream to take "O" levels a year early (2nd form, 3rd, LE, GE*) as opposed to (2nd, 3rd, LF, UF, GE). I somehow got in the fast stream but struggled near the bottom of the bottom sets and lost confidence. My "O" levels were adequate but I ended up getting very low "A" level grades despite using the extra year to retake.

It may well be that I was too thick to succeed at "A" level but I used to wonder whether I'd have done better with the mental boost (and thus added confidence) of being near the top in top sets rather than near the bottom in bottom ones. On the other hand I might have become complacent so who knows?

CH no longer employs that "O" level (GCSE) fast track system though so I have subsequently been told. The progression now is 2nd, 3rd, LE, UF, GE.

* GE is Great Erasmus, LE is Little Erasmus. LF is Lower Fourth, UF is Upper Fourth.

[fra828]

([/quote]

You are spot on there.

At Horsham there was a "fast" stream to take "O" levels a year early (2nd form, 3rd, LE, GE*) as opposed to (2nd, 3rd, LF, UF, GE). I somehow got in the fast stream but struggled near the bottom of the bottom sets and lost confidence. My "O" levels were adequate but I ended up getting very low "A" level grades despite using the extra year to retake.

It may well be that I was too thick to succeed at "A" level but I used to wonder whether I'd have done better with the mental boost (and thus added confidence) of being near the top in top sets rather than near the bottom in bottom ones. On the other hand I might have become complacent so who knows?

CH no longer employs that "O" level (GCSE) fast track system though so I have subsequently been told. The progression now is 2nd, 3rd, LE, UF, GE.

* GE is Great Erasmus, LE is Little Erasmus. LF is Lower Fourth, UF is Upper Fourth.[/quote]

Educationally speaking, I have always thought it better to be top of the bottom set rather than bottom of the top, if that makes any sense! Memory of a comment from DR when I was at the end of my 1st year: 'going on your entrance exam, you should be in the A form'. Well that says a lot about my lack of motivation to work at Hertford.

[Katharine]

I quite agree with the philosophy of being near the top of a group. Our elder son is severely dyslexic, but very intelligent. The boys went through the prep and public school system because of our peripatetic life overseas. When he was approaching the Common Entrance Year we were in Britain for a parents' day and were told he was borderline for the Scholarship set, we both resolutely said No Way. He thrived at the top of the next set and made so much progress that we reluctantly agreed to his trying for a scholarship - he achieved an 18% Scholarship in Sciences. His peer group made such a fuss of him - not all the Scholarship set had got them. (No doubt they were horrid little tykes to the ones who had not got them - but I was not told that!) He was chaired around the whole school on their shoulders. It did wonders for his self confidence. He now has a PhD in Physical Chemistry.

[fra828]

I quite agree with the philosophy of being near the top of a group. Our elder son is severely dyslexic, but very intelligent. The boys went through the prep and public school system because of our peripatetic life overseas. When he was approaching the Common Entrance Year we were in Britain for a parents' day and were told he was borderline for the Scholarship set, we both resolutely said No Way. He thrived at the top of the next set and made so much progress that we reluctantly agreed to his trying for a scholarship - he achieved an 18% Scholarship in Sciences. His peer group made such a fuss of him - not all the Scholarship set had got them. (No doubt they were horrid little tykes to the ones who had not got them - but I was not told that!) He was chaired around the whole school on their shoulders. It did wonders for his self confidence. He now has a PhD in Physical Chemistry.

That is very inspiring- well done to your son, Katharine! My daughter who is now 21 and has Down's Syndrome, attended a special school, and at Post 16 they had 2 'streamed' groups. She ended up in the less able group, but really thrived and her teacher said she loved being 'top-dog'! She's now at college with schoolfriends doing 'life skills' course.

(Spelling error corrected by me. J.R.)